it did not happen in the navy. women are a much higher percentage of the navy than they were back in 1994. women kept joining and joining in bigger numbers. >> in my experience, along the way, a lot more women got out because of the opportunities denied to them rather than offer to them. >> good point. >> exactly. >> in the canadian forces, how did that disintegration occur? what's the lessons to be learned from the way it was implemented? >> well, in 1987, the canadian forces saw it coming with the complaints before the tribunal and hearings takes place. in 1987, there was the trials designed to determine if, when, and how the restrictions to the oi point -- appointment of women could be changed. in hindsight, they look back and see it as a natural part of the progression to put women in combat arms, but looking back and what happened, it was very much set up to test the impact of women on combat operational units. an important point here is when we talk about quotas and critical mass and talk about goals, the cre